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I find the best way to get people to think about "vax-ports" is to ask them:

"How many shots are you going to take?"

Then tell them the following:

"Canada has bought 135 million MORE shots for 38 million people. That's 3 MORE each plus extra for spoilage and waste"

Then follow up with:

"Israel just took away privileges from 1.5 million people for refusing the 3rd injection. They've announced the 4th is coming. Lithuania is the same but announcing the 4th & 5th shots"

And finally leave them with this thought:

"You can say "NO" at zero injections or you can say "NO" at 3, 4, 5 and the result is the same. When you REFUSE you lose all your PRIVILEGES because you have NO RIGHTS. You gave them away when you agreed to the vaccine passport"

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Chris Voss is an FBI agent who negotiated with terrorists for years to get kidnappers to return their victims. He wrote an awesome book, "Never Split the Difference." He has a YouTube channel and a website www.blackswanltd.com. His main point is that you need to listen to the other person and repeat their talking points. Trying to emulate Chris Voss I thought of responding to a family that rejected their nephew from attending Thanksgiving dinner because he was unvaccinated. No matter how he tried to argue, they were too afraid to let him attend. I guess I would start out with, "Seems like you're afraid that vaccination won't protect you. Can you say more about your concerns?" NOTE: They are less defensive. And look, they are now arguing OUR point. That vaccines are not perfect. Voss always states that the point is to end the conversation without breaking the relationship. Maybe I won't get to join my family for Thanksgiving. But maybe they will still know that I care for them. And that treatments exist so that the viral can be stopped from replicating without entering the hospital. There is no one simple message because we are censored. All the public hears is "safe and effective, safe and effective--only vaccines can save us." Avoid getting trapped in vaccines vs. no vaccines. Consider that we need every medical treatment possible to ensure our health and safety. We all need it. And it works.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I'd don't want to sound like the bleakest of the subscribers so I hope you all understand I'm trying to be as pragmatic and compassionate as I can be. As Laurence Flynn commented earlier, only certain kinds of experience - usually of the negative variety - have a chance to snap someone out of their somnambulant existence. You have to go through some kind of crisis or trauma to have any hope of reevaluating the habitual choices you make every day. That's especially true when it comes to discovering a healthy lifestyle, which to me is the most critical component to your survival in the new reality that covid has created. But the problem started long before the propagation of this new virus. If this country or most others have any chance at a real future, then it's essential that people turn their backs on the "better living through chemistry" philosophy that was born in the post-WWII era. Engineered food - lifeless except for the fortification that goes into it - combined with pharmaceutical drugs that suppress the symptoms which arise from it's consumption are almost entirely to blame for the number of deaths we've see around the world (at least in my humble opinion). And it would be great if more people could be converted to a better way of living. However, just like when you try to help someone struggling with addiction, you can only hope to help them when they are ready to help themselves. The best advice is to live by example, showing your most beloved family and friends the power that exists if they embrace a more wholesome and common sense lifestyle. Don't waste your energy on those that aren't actively seeking a change or those that want to argue and fight with you. Let go of your anger over the broken system and the censorship and corruption that protects it. Unless you want to dedicate your life to activism against those systems, your energy would be far better spent building a garden in your community, teaching cooking classes to young children, and preparing for a life when all the wrong ways of living finally collapse around us. Most of us reading Toby's post already know the Matrix-like prison around us is so wrong and nonsensical, but we have a choice in every moment of our day to begin building a reality that frees us from it and its perverse way of thinking and being. Only through collective community building will the wise and compassionate of us ever find the peace and happiness we seek. All of you please be well!

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At this point, we'll have two chances to change minds. But to be honest the changing of minds won't be done by words. There is nothing you can say to change the mind of the devout. They have to experience something. That will either be the death of many children or it will be seeing neighbours being rounded up and sent to the gulag. Either way, it's too late. Time to face the fact that we've lost this war and plan for how to survive the coming societal armageddon. I'm 95% pessimist and 5% optimist now. But it's the 5% that keeps me going.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I am not sure it matters which brain we appeal to. It seems that explaining the rational science doesn't work any better than bluntly announcing the root of the problem in very clear language. I don't think the latter makes us like pharma at all--we are not trying to manipulate people with that language--to the contrary, we would be trying to wake them from their stupor. But from what I have seen, the pharma control is impervious to all of it because they've sucked people in--using billions to inundate with clever marketing campaigns. And if you fell for it and got vaxxed, it's simply too late to change your mind. You cannot get unvaxxed. It seems once your vaxxed, you're committed no matter what. It would take some major event to change that.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I think the other component here is that, since people are operating from a stress response right now, and that fight/flight response is activated, they are looking for a relief from that stress. Big pharma has semingly come to the "rescue" with what people perceive as these "life-saving" vaccines. And people are angry if you suggest they are not life-saving. "How dare you suggest this isn't the thing that will save us all??" So perhaps the solution is that we have to empathize ("I know it was scary when your friend's unvaccinated cousin was hospitalized due to COVID...") but also suggest some practical alternatives ("Since vaccinated are getting covid too, what would you think of exploring some early treatment options?"). I'm trying to get my pro-vax family mentally prepared that we will all likely get covid eventually, and we might as well be ready...I try to be gentle in breaking the truth that the vaccine won't save us, so they don't shoot the messenger.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I’m not sure if I’m more angry or afraid… the fact that people of ALL levels of, so called, “intelligence” have no deductive reasoning/critical thinking skills to even be able to see the problems with all of this themselves! There are so many logical arguments against all of these measures!!! And they ALL make sense! I pointed out one simple thing to a friend: NEVER BEFORE… never… has a pathogen been so widely tested for not only with a test… but a bogus test (PCR)… There’s absolutely NOTHING to compare it to! And every decision has been based on fear, not real facts. None of the numbers are accurate.. because $ was such a driving factor… and it still is! The same entities, organizations, companies, and countries that have benefited from CV19 ARE STILL BENEFITING FROM IT!!! PHARMa companies more than doubled in value!!! But this is about “health” and “safety”

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I agree that we need a simpler message. On another substack today I found myself annoyed at criticisms of an author - some readers wanted more careful data. While true for RATIONAL people, our mindless lost friends are not analyzing data, they are swallowing soundbites.

So.

I guess we need soundbites.

We can play that game but I'd like us to hold onto our integrity.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I've done both. When approaching with logic, they pull the argument of authority. E.g., The FDA wouldn't approve something that is harmful or Health Canada approved it so it must be safe. When I lead with reptilian appeals (this is about digital currency and the Great Reset, do NOT get the QR code), they look at me, with pity, and brush off my appeals as that of a crazed-lady who has been spending too much time in lockdown, down various rabbit holes rife with conspiracy theories. Both approaches = FAIL.

But, I had an epiphany while reading both this article and Mathew's this morning, about Jung and other psychological theories I haven't thought directly about in a while.

When I've stated to a few people, calmly, that I am not jabbed and have no intention of being so (not appealing to logic or the reptilian brain) , they strike back, often angrily. I was inferring they get angry as they've bought into the cult of "it's a pandemic of the unvaccinated and we are the enemy." However, I am now thinking that they get angry, as I've penetrated their bubble of defence, ever so slightly. I'm not trying to convince them, nor make excuses. They know my background, we have a history, and they can't reconcile what I'm stating with what the media is telling them (anti-vaxxers are right-wing, trump loving, knuckle dragging, anti-science red-necks). So it creates a crack in the glass-wall between our world and the parallel universe where they dwell, characterized by denial.

This won't accomplish much on the spot, but when they come across something else that doesn't make sense, perhaps they will start to come out of their zombie-trance. Hope springs eternal.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I love this piece Toby as it describes the psychology of the vaccine cult that I have been struggling to understand now for the last 18 months and my attempts to try to reach them. I've been trying to open that "industrial metal shutter" but it is locked and impossible to break in to. What will it take for the shop owner to realize he has to open his doors and awaken his unconsciousness? Some will become conscious but many will not and it will be too late. For me, it's about finding the shop owners who's locks have been broken and they just need help opening their steel shutter. Thank you Toby!!!

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Sara Vee asked the same question: https://undividedattention.substack.com/p/how-can-we-have-thoughtful-productive

My thoughts there were: emotive narrative. Logic and reason were not used to transition and thus will not work to undo the transition.

Socratic questioning may help. People will need to be triggered into making connections and coming to realisations. They will or cannot be told, but have to work it out themselves.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

All comments I've read are fantastic and touch on many aspects of the situation, so it is clearly not straightforward.

As it was with Galileo, he saw and understood the data, the church did not.

As it was in WWII, the Allies believed in "our side" to cooperate and do good, while the other side followed the propaganda but believed they too were doing good.

Both situations took years to resolve.

I talked to a vaccinated 20ish person who had not heard about the Nuremberg trials and why they happened.

.

If I'm a vaccinated person, telling me that I did wrong or will develop blood clots, strokes, dementia, heart attacks or even die will only make me close my ears because it's not acceptable that I may have made a wrong decision and may have hurt myself. I must defend that I did the right thing.

Freedom of choice or medical privacy is also not an argument to the vaccinated who did it "for the greater good".

The trust in the system seems to be the underlying problem.

Why would the government hurt us?

Why would Pharma hurt us?

Take this pill, don't worry about your diet.

Eat this processed food, if you get sick we'll fix you.

.

There is too much reliance on others to keep us safe and healthy. And when they offer up stuff, we take it without questioning.

.

Fortunately, the narrative is unraveling as real data is coming to light.

Fortunately, people are willing to say no to the 3rd or 4th shot.

Fortunately, many parents are saying no to their 5 year old being injected.

Unfortunately, many innocent children will die needlessly because their parents think they will be "doing the right thing".

Unfortunately, more adults will die after the 3rd, 4th or 5th dose.

We need to stay the course, share the data, defend our freedom to choose and defend our medical privacy until this ship can turn around.

This is our WWIII.

It will take time, but if we give in to these thugs, they will be injecting us with all sorts of deadly liquids forevermore.

.

I want to go back to the good old days when I argued with people about reversing diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure and obesity using Low Carb, Keto or Carnivore diets - which would also eliminate all the comorbidities that people are dying from, hmmm.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

Eugyppius has an interesting take on this: https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/how-to-argue-and-how-this-ends

It's very apparent at this point that arguing rationally with people who don't realize that they have already drunk the kool-aid is a losing proposition, however there is very damning data in the pharma trials themselves so maybe trying to get people to actually read those studies can help some (however literacy in statistical methods is rare).

Alex Berenson noted this week that the CDC has simply stopped reporting data that reflects badly on the vaccine efficacy, ratios of infection, etc so at least for the US the stats can't even speak for themselves. I half expect total censorship as excess mortality climbs, at least here in the US. They may simply stop reporting anything of substance.

I am planning my exit from productive society and moving to the reddest state possible. In the end our survival and health may be the lasting proof, but even that is very problematic if we are denied access to hospitals or other care without the gene therapy.

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I have been studying why so many people I know, family included, were so quick to believe that they were doing their civic duty to put their arm out, with total trust and no looking back. And it is because since they were children they have been blinded to the indoctrination of how the system has groomed them to act for the system's good, and not their own. Rewards were readily provided as replacement from the struggle to survive as autonomous individuals; who from their struggle gain insight into reality. These people I speak about, were prevented from that, from the start. And, they have been deceived all along to think they were doing good, because the system told them so. It didn't come from within, that wouldn't be acceptable. and not trustworthy in the eyes of the system. Thus, few of them have had the courage over their years of grooming to question why the perks have been so good, and their lives have gained status, wealth and recognition from those who groomed them. The walls of the box, of their reality, are too thick. I have to say I feel sorry for these people. I don't see them as Nazis--my ancestors were in the holocaust--I see them as victims to their own demise, as the system they have always believed in--now a reflection of themselves--crumbles.

Here is a very good blog post from bad cattitude--it follows well after yours:

https://boriquagato.substack.com/p/anatomy-of-a-a-dependency-culture?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjoyOTI2MzQzNiwicG9zdF9pZCI6NDQxMzIyOTAsIl8iOiI2b2FQdCIsImlhdCI6MTYzNzE1ODM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjM3MTYxOTQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMzIzOTE0Iiwic3ViIjoicG9zdC1yZWFjdGlvbiJ9.Fq18vhUpkXqtYRm-ogV6-iowYvoBjr5TcuG4zH-gB0w

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I think the mistake might be trying to convince them of anything. It’s very difficult to reason someone out of a position they did not reason themselves into said Thomas Sowell.

Some of us saw the never-ending “vaccine” train right from the start and refused to get on board. Many of us smelled a rat with this whole “Covid” scam at the outset. We are the fortunate ones.

There are some people who are going to march themselves off a cliff no matter what. As with drugs and alcohol, same with “Covid”.

But we should treat them kindly, firstly for the sake of our own souls, and secondly because alcoholics and drug addicts who have truly reformed of their own volition can make the best anti drug-and-alcohol campaigners. Let’s make the side of truth be the warmly welcoming side of goodness and love.

Superior argumentation is far less effective at changing hearts and minds than is simply living the truth, in beauty, with goodness, no matter what. The second way is more personally demanding, but far more rewarding, for many more reasons than just the obvious.

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Nov 17, 2021Liked by Toby Rogers

I have spent the last three months in the most anguished turmoil as most of my family and friends have gotten the jab. I am finding new friends….a new tribe and I am feeling empowered and of course terrified as my 16 year old son has gotten the jab. I did not feel I could stop him and his dad (my ex) I am doing everything in my power to keep him away from the booster.

At this point I do not talk about the vaccine to my former friends and family. My focus is my son and myself. Staying as healthy as I can to do what I can in my power to join the mass numbers of us standing up. I have been quiet for too many years as I’ve watched the takeover of Big Pharma.

I know I do a fuck ton more research then any of my friends and family combined. I just keep reminding myself I am not alone… I just happen to momentarily be surrounded by zombies. Hey, how is your 24/7 cognitive dissonance treating you?

A very smart and dear old friend of mine just invited me to her backyard chili cook-off. She said not to worry because everyone was vaccinated.

I’d like to show up with a big bucket of chili and dump it on top of everyone else’s chili and say,

“I hope y’all have a nice day”

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